Context: X11Libre is a fork of X11 aiming at preserving the X Server (fair enough, right?). One of the creators got permanently banned from freedesktop.org for apparently violating the Code of Conduct (no info on that, they just blame Red Hat), see themselves as hunted by both Big Tech and “toxic elements” who “took over the X11 project” They want to “make X great again”.
The issue about their highly political README (which they wrote due to the original project “becoming too political”, lol) also contains the usual red flags like transphobia. https://github.com/X11Libre/xserver/issues/40
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Found more context, for who is now curious:
- Apparently threatening violence with guns is okay (just got marked as “off-topic”).
- The maintainer of X11Libre, Enrico Weigelt, is an anti-vaxer who already got scolded by Torvalds for writing bullshit on the kernel mailing list
The more I read into X11Libre, the more I’m laughing. Now the freedesktop ban also makes perfect sense.
The maintainer of X11Libre, Enrico Weigelt, is an anti-vaxer who already got scolded by Torvalds for writing bullshit on the kernel mailing list
Oh, so it’s him. Dude got absolutely lucky Linus is on mild mode nowadays. On his prime the scold would’ve been of such epic proportions all the viruses he could have on his body would’ve leave him out of pure cringe.
Reminds me of the Hyprland dev and the shit that community is. https://drewdevault.com/2024/04/09/2024-04-09-FDO-conduct-enforcement.html
I miss the days when the OS community found -often painful- ways to deal with excentric or even toxic and erratic developers. That definitely had more class than conformist mobs celebrating each character assassination of somebody disagreeing. Not that I’d support any anti-vax bullshit or bigotry, I just dislike mobs of holier-than-thous. Because they aren’t holy or as “good” as they think they are. IMO they’re just the sort of people waiting for a reason to get their torches and pitchforks. I don’t think that’s any better, morally, or less intolerant than having unhinged opinions.
the OS community found -often painful- ways to deal with excentric or even toxic and erratic developers.
Do you have an example? I’m honestly not sure what you are referring to here. And I’ve been around for a while.
“No, go away.”
That’s a perfectly valid way to deal with toxic contributors. There’s always people with better social skills and equal developer skills out there, you don’t have to accept and include toxic people just because they wrote some code.
Just alienate them more and they will get better on their own… Right?
I think the guy you’re responding to is saying that communication and not alienation is how we bring these people out of whatever holes they’ve dug themselves into.
I know hes getting downvoted a ton, but if my take on what he wrote is correct then I also agree with him.
The reason the world is so divided right now is because nobody wants to talk through things with open minds and with empathy.
“Meet me in the middle” says the unjust man.
You take a step towards him, he takes a step back.
“Meet me in the middle” says the unjust man.You can’t engage such people in good faith, and it’s impossible to convince them to adopt a different viewpoint. People much smarter than you have tried and failed.
I don’t doubt it… but there has to be some way to pull people back from the hole they’ve dug themselves into. Straight up ignoring them seems counterproductive, but you’re right… I’m not an expert and im sure people have tried
It just feels sad and frustrating to me as well. This guy obviously seems to have some talent but got sucked into something that overshadows his talent with just plain idiocy on things he doesn’t know anything about it seems like…
Really sad times
Edit: just read the article you sent. This was particularly in the case of sending out messaging where people can’t have a discussion back with you.
The thing is, that there must be some corner from which you can start arguing. Rightwing ideology is in itself a relatively complete world image, where everything that does not fit into their world is a lie. If someone is willing to actually listen to you, discuss in a civilised manner and tries to understand what your point is, than you can have long and exhausting discussions slowly but steadily deconstructing the persons world view.
However, if the discussions consists of “this is woke and a lie” and they are not willing to listen to you, than theres nothing you can do for them. Trist me, my parents are conspiracy theorists and I gave up in them. I Am willing to start arguing with them, if they are ever willing to come back into society, but for now their whole social group consists of conspiracy theorists and they are not willing to understand how science works, so any discussion is pointless.
I do think that even with the “this is woke I’m not listening” crowd it’s possible. You need to practice active listening to get in the door though. Tell them what you hear and explain it in your words. Sometimes you hear wrong and sometimes they realize how dumb it sounds when you repeat it again.
Idk it seems totally possible… A lot of work… But possible. Aside from raising my kids to think correctly and be good people that’s the only other way I can benefit society / the people around me. I just listen and challenge, and try to keep my personal feelings out of it initially.
It just really feels like people want everything distilled into a 30s tiktok video and its really hard to see everything go that direction…
I miss the days when we tolerated assholes and bigots instead of calling them out.
You’re not calling out anyone here. That has happened elsewhere. You’re nothing but gossiping about it. You’re not the defenders of anything but spiteful, ugly people.
If you want to know more about how unhinged the dude is, I recommend reading this email thread in the DNG mailing list.
X11 was never great.
(Like seriously, it’s nothing but config files you have to edit from the local console shell and and proprietary stuff from nvidia that misbehaves, all the way down. Always has been.)
To be fair they made a lot of strides to the point where config file wrangling went from mandatory to almost never done.
But yes, Nvidia would have quirks driving people back to wrangling config file, but they got better too.
Though I’m not particularly interested in X11. The biggest thing they had was trivial application forwarding, but the architecture didn’t scale well to modern resolutions and UI design that was largely bitmaps being pushed, as well as not handling higher latency networks too well.
