udon

Yes, guix should be in there. Not sure if it was the crippled gnu at the bottom, but belongs in chad level

Thanks for the notice

Just live program your system from scratch every time you start your computer

It’s called Stockholm syndrome

However, aptitude why <package> is pretty handy

Dude/dudesse, what the hell is this and why have I never heard of it? Sounds really useful on the manpage, I hope I remember it next time I need it. Thanks! 😊

Don’t panic, apt+flatpak does everything very well, if all you need is a working computer. If you need a hobby, try nix or guix

I’m interested in the topic in general, but not in explaining that declarative systems don’t solve the problem of continuously changing software (e.g., for security updates, changing landscape), and the need to update configs that goes along with it. Hope that helps!

Okay, not really interested in this discussion. Of course, I can also keep running Debian 10 forever

Except that things change as well in (or rather “around”) declarative systems, and you have to update your config files as well. That’s because the underlying software changes, and it has nothing to do with whether your system is declarative or not. You just need to put in the work to update your configs at a different point in time.

For everyone who doesn’t have several different systems to maintain, I find the advantages of nixOS to be marginal. Sure, you can argue about atomicity and all, but honestly I don’t remember ever running into a serious problem with debian either. The huge package repo is nice, but I rarely encounter an app I can’t get through apt, flatpak, or as an appimage.

At the same time, nix also has various downsides. Documentation sucks. There are two main ways to manage the system, they both pretend to be the better one, and it’s super hard to even get started. That’s not an issue with the technology, but just a lack of priority. Guix is much better on that end (but also comes with the same marginal advantages).

On the other hand, debian has a stable community, with proper processes, democratic structures etc.

This is a nice, kind of old presentation from debconf, where people discussed nix and how this could be useful in a debian context as well:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jGrcLEweglg

So, if you FOMO, don’t worry. Debian and other options have this on the radar and have their ways to adapt (even if slowly)

Waiting for the day they finally drop it… … like unity … like mir … like ubuntu mobile (or whatever it was called)

3 years, so I guess you have caught the Linux virus around that time as well?

They have a history of showing ads and sharing user data with amazon: https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2012/10/privacy-ubuntu-1210-amazon-ads-and-data-leaks

Some of the other things they tried are a bit difficult to judge, but I lost my trust and count them as lock-in attempts. These include:

• snap packages (for real, just move over to flatpak already like everyone else!)
• mir: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mir_(software)

Notable good parts that I have not mentioned, but maybe should out of fairness:

• unity: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unity_(user_interface)
• I also think canonical was among the first to try and build some form of Linux mobile OS with some interesting ideas

True, the apt packages can get outdated (or are already outdated at release time :) ). But tbh, for me that mainly affects the desktop environment these days and KDE is already pretty neat anyway. The CLI tools I use don’t change as much anymore, and the GUI tools are usually available as a flatpak so up-to-date.

Intolerable, scammy OS. Everything good in Ubuntu these days can be traced back to other projects, such as debian/Gnome/KDE. Whatever Canonical adds to that is just an attempt to lock you in their ecosystem or wring money out of you.

Just use debian instead.

Which is, btw, no real effect but just autocorrelation:

https://economicsfromthetopdown.com/2022/04/08/the-dunning-kruger-effect-is-autocorrelation/

Right, how is anything more sustainable than Debian?

And I thought all Arch users already switched to Nix OS (BTW)

🚲